关于人性的44个残酷真相 - 纳瓦尔最新访谈 3 小时完整版_原文
关于人性的44个残酷真相 - 纳瓦尔最新访谈 3 小时完整版_原文
Happiness is being satish ed with what you have. Success comes from dissatisfaction. It's success. What is done if . 幸福在于满足于已有之物。成功源于永不满足。这就是成功。若已达成...
i'm not sure that statement is true anymore like I made this time in a long time ago. And a lot of these things are just note to myself, and they're highly contextual. They come in the moment to live, in the moment happiness. 我不确定这个观点现在是否依然成立，就像我很久以前写下这段话时那样。其中很多内容只是给自己的备忘，具有极强的时效性——它们诞生于特定时刻，活在当下，即时幸福。
okay. So very complicated topic. But I was like the soccer story where he goes into the marketplace and they show him all these luxuries. 这是个相当复杂的话题。让我想起那个苏格拉底的故事：当他走进市集，人们向他展示各种奢侈品时...
And fine reason, he says, how many things there are in this world that I do not want, and that's a form of freedom. So not wanting something is as good as having IT. In the old story with Alexander diagnosis, right? Alexander goes out and conquers the world that he meets. 这位哲人说道："世间有多少东西是我不需要的"，这本身就是一种自由。不渴望某物与拥有它同样珍贵。就像古代亚历山大大帝的故事——他征服世界后遇见第欧根尼，对吧？
Diameter is living in a barrel and diameter is says, get out of the way you're blocking my son and Alexander says, oh, how I wish how you know could be like diameter is in the next life and dynastic is that's a difference. I don't wish that I could so that says, wish to be Alexander so two pads to happiness and uh, one paris for success. You get what you want to satisfy your material needs or like diogenes, you just don't want in the first place. 第欧根尼住在木桶里，他喊道："让开，你挡住我的阳光了！"亚历山大却说："来世我多么希望能成为第欧根尼啊。"而第欧根尼回应："这就是我们的区别——我根本不想成为亚历山大。"通往幸福有两条路：要么像亚历山大那样追逐成功来满足物质欲望，要么像第欧根尼那样从一开始就无欲无求。
And i'm not sure which one is more valid. And IT also depends to define success if the end goal is happiness, then why not cut to the chase and just go straight for IT? Uh, does being happy make you less successful? That is a conventional wisdom that may even be the practical earned experience of your reality. 我不确定哪种方式更有意义。这也取决于如何定义成功——如果终极目标是幸福，何不直接追求幸福本身？难道快乐会让你变得不够成功吗？这种传统观念或许正是现实给我们的深刻教训。
You find that when you're a happy, you don't want anything so you don't get up and do anything. On the other hand, you know, you still got to do something. You are animal. 你会发现，当感到满足时就会失去奋斗动力；但另一方面，人终究需要行动。因为我们是动物啊。
You're here. You're here to survive. You here to replicate your driven. 你存在于世。你要生存。你要繁衍后代。这是本能驱使。
You're motivated. You're gonna something. You're not just going to sit there all day. Unlikely some people do. Maybe it's in their nature, but I think most people still want to act. They want to live in the arena. 你充满干劲。你决心有所作为。你不会整天无所事事地坐着。不像某些人那样。也许这是他们的天性，但我认为大多数人仍然渴望行动。他们想在竞技场中拼搏。
I found for myself, as i've become uh, happier is a big word, but you know more peaceful, more calm, more present, more, uh, satisfied with what I have, uh, I still want to do things. I just want to do Better things. I want to do things that are more pure, more a line with, uh, what I think needs to be done and what I can uniquely do. So in that sense, I think that being happier can actually make you more successful, but your definition of successful will likely change along the way. 就我个人而言，随着我变得——用"快乐"这个词可能有点大——但确实更平和、更从容、更活在当下、对现有的一切更满足时，我依然想做事。只是现在想做更好的事。我想做更纯粹的事，更符合我认为需要完成且只有我能独特完成的事。从这个意义上说，我认为变得更快乐实际上能让你更成功，不过你对成功的定义很可能在这个过程中发生改变。
Is that a realization you think you could have gotten to how you have not had some success in the first place? 你觉得如果没有先取得一些成就，你能否领悟到这个道理？
At least for me, I always wanted to take the path of material success first. I was not going to go be anesthetic and sit there and renounce everything that just seems too unreliable and too painful ah in the story of buda, he starts out as a prince and then he sees that it's all kind of meaningless because you're still gonna old and die and then he goes into the woods looking for something more. I'll take the happy route that involves a material success. Thank you. 至少对我来说，我一直想先走物质成功的道路。我不打算像佛陀故事里那样麻醉自己，坐在那里放弃一切——那看起来太不可靠也太痛苦了。佛陀起初是个王子，后来发现这一切都毫无意义，因为人终究会衰老死亡，于是他走进森林寻求更高境界。而我会选择那条包含物质成就的幸福之路。谢谢。
I think it's quicker in some ways. One of your insights far easy to achieve our material desires, that is, to announce them IT . 我认为在某些方面这样更快。你的一个深刻见解是：实现物质欲望其实很简单，那就是公开宣告它们。
depends on the person. But II think you have to try the path. If you want something, go get IT. Uh, no, I, I, I quip that the reason to win the game is to be free of IT. So you you play the games, you win the games and then you get hopefully get bored of the games. You don't want to just keep looping on the same game over and over, although a lot of these games are very enticing and have many levels in a relatively open ended, uh, and then you become free of the game, uh, in a sense that you're no longer trying to win IT. You know you can win IT and either you move to a different game or you play the game . 这取决于个人。但我认为你必须尝试这条路。若有所求，就去争取。呃不，我常开玩笑说，赢得游戏的目的是为了摆脱它。所以你玩游戏、赢得游戏，最终希望能对游戏感到厌倦。你不想反复沉迷于同一款游戏，尽管很多游戏极具诱惑力，拥有相对开放的多个关卡...而后你就能从游戏中解脱，某种意义上你不再执着于取胜。你明白自己能够获胜，于是要么转战其他游戏，要么纯粹为乐趣而玩。
for the sheer joy of IT yeah, you another one of yours. Most of the gains in life come from suffering in the short term, so I can get paid in the long term. I think classic winning the Marshall test, yeah, on a daily basis. 纯粹为了享受乐趣对吧？你另一个观点是：人生多数收获都源于短期受苦，以换取长期回报。我觉得这就像经典的马歇尔测试，每天都在验证这个道理。
But there's an interesting chAllenge where I think people need to avoid becoming AA suffering addict, sort of using suffering as the proxy for progress as opposed to the outcome of the suffering, right? It's like I was in pain not eating the marshmallow. I was in pain doing this work. I have attached well being and satisfaction to pain, not to what the pain gets me on the other side of IT. 但这里有个耐人寻味的挑战——人们需要避免沦为"痛苦成瘾者"，错把煎熬当作进步的代名词，而非煎熬带来的成果，明白吗？就像我忍着不吃棉花糖时感到痛苦，埋头苦干时也感到痛苦。我把幸福感和满足感与痛苦本身绑定，而非痛苦彼岸的收获。
If you define pain as physical pain, then it's a real thing that happens. And you can ignore IT. But that's not what we mean by suffering. 若将疼痛定义为生理痛感，那确实是真实存在的感受。你可以选择忽略它。但这并非我们所说的"煎熬"。
Suffering is mostly mental anguish and mental pain and IT just means you don't want to do the task at hand. Uh, if you were fine doing the task at hand, then wouldn't be sufficing. And then the question is, what's more effective to suffer along the way or just to interpret IT in the way that is not suffering. 煎熬更多是精神层面的折磨与苦楚，它只意味着你抗拒手头的任务。呃，如果你甘之如饴地执行任务，那就谈不上煎熬了。于是问题来了：是全程硬扛着煎熬更有效，还是直接转换思维根本不觉其苦更明智？
You hear from a lot of successful people, they look back and they say all the journey was a fun part, right? That was actually the entertaining part I should have enjoy IT more. It's a common regret. Uh, there's a little thought exercise i'll like to do, which is you can go back into your own life and try to put yourself in the exact position you are in five years ago, ten years ago, fifteen years ago, twenty years ago. And you try to remember, okay, who was I weird? What was I doing? What was I feeling? All of my emotions, all of my objectives, and really, really try to transport yourself back and see if there's any advice to give yourself anything you do differently. 许多成功人士回首往事时都会说，整个奋斗过程才是最有趣的，对吧？那段时光本应更享受才对——这是种普遍的遗憾。我常做个小思维实验：试着穿越回五年前、十年前、十五年前甚至二十年前的自己。你要努力回忆：当时的自己有多青涩？在做什么事？怀着怎样的心情？调动所有情绪记忆和目标指向，真正把自己投射回过去，看看能否给当年的自己任何建议，或是做出不同选择。
Now you don't have new information. Don't pretend you could have gone back in. You bought a stock or bought big corner, whatever. But just knowing what you know now in terms of you, your temperament and a little bit of age related experience, how would you've done things differently? And I think it's a worthwhile excise to do. So don't let me rob you of the conclusion but i'll tell you for me ah, I would have done everything the same except I would have done IT with less anger, less emotion, less internal suffering because I was option AI wasn't necessary and I would argue that someone who can do the job, uh, at least peacefully, but maybe happily, is going to be more effective than someone who has a nessy emotional . 你现在并没有新的信息。别假装你本可以重新来过。不管你是买了股票还是大举押注某个领域。但根据你现在的认知、你的性格特点以及些许与年龄相关的经验，你会采取哪些不同的做法？我认为这是个值得深思的练习。别让我替你得出结论，但就我而言——我会做出完全相同的选择，只是会减少愤怒、降低情绪波动、减轻内心煎熬，因为那些焦虑本无必要。我敢说，能以至少平和、甚至愉悦心态完成工作的人，会比那些被负面情绪裹挟的人更高效。
and where you end up with a series of miserable successes, right? The outcome may have been the same, but the entire experience of getting that and in the journey . 最终你收获的是一连串痛苦的胜利，对吧？结果或许相同，但整个达成目标的过程和旅途体验却截然不同。
is not only the reward, the journey, the thing there is, you know, even success is human nature to bank IT very, very quickly, right? Because a Normal loop that we run through as you sit around your board, then you want something, then when you want something, you decide you're not going to be happy until you get that thing. Then you start your out of suffering or anticipation while you strive to get that thing. 追求目标的过程本身就是意义所在，而非仅是结果。要知道，即便是成功带来的喜悦，人类天性也会很快将其视为理所当然。我们通常陷入这样的循环：当你坐在会议室里渴望某样东西时，就会认定只有得到它才能快乐。于是你开始经历煎熬或期待，拼命追逐那个目标。
If you get that thing, then you get used to IT and then you get bored again. Then a few months later, you want something else. And if you don't get IT, then you're unhappy for a bit, then you get over IT, then you want something else, right? That's the Normal cycle. 若你最终如愿以偿，很快便会习以为常，继而感到厌倦。几个月后，你又会产生新的渴望。倘若未能达成目标，短暂沮丧后你也会释怀，转而追求其他事物。这就是常态的循环。
So whether you're happy, you're unhappy at the end, IT tends not to last. Now I don't want to be global and say that, oh, there is no point in making money or be successful. There absolutely is. 因此无论结局是喜是悲，这种情绪往往难以持久。我并非要全盘否定——绝不是说赚钱或追求成功毫无意义。它们当然重要。
Money solves all your money problems. So IT is good to have money. Um that said, there are those uh those stories. I think those studies, I don't know how real these are, all these site studies don't, but it's a fun, fun little study that shows that a people who break their back and people who win the lottery are back to their baseline happiness two years later. Again, I don't know this entirely true. 金钱能解决你所有的财务困境。所以拥有财富是件好事。不过话说回来，总有些研究案例——虽然我不确定这些调查数据的真实性，毕竟网络研究往往靠不住——但有个有趣的调查显示：无论是拼命工作的人还是彩票中奖者，两年后都会回归原有的幸福基准线。当然，我并不完全确信这个结论。
I think money can buy you happiness if you earned IT, because then along the way, you have both pride and confidence in yourself and you have a sense of accomplishment and you, you know, set out to do something, and you are right. So II bet that lingers. And then as I said, money solves money problems. 我认为通过努力赚取的金钱确实能带来幸福，因为在这个过程中，你会获得自豪感与自信心，体会到成就感——当你设定目标并最终实现时，这种满足感会持续发酵。正如我所说，金钱能解决金钱引发的问题。
I don't want to be too glad about IT, but I would say in general this this loop that we runs through um of desire, dopamine, fulfilled men, unfulfilled men, you have to enjoy the journey. The journey is all there is right. Nine and nine percent time was spent on the journey. So what kind of a journey is that if you're . 虽然不想过分乐观，但我们必须承认：人类始终困在欲望-多巴胺-满足-空虚的循环里。关键在于享受奋斗的过程，因为人生本就是一场旅程。我们 99%的时间都耗费在路上，若不能乐在其中，这样的征程又有何意义？
not going to enjoy IT, how do you sure cut that desire contract? 若无法享受这个过程，又如何打破欲望的枷锁呢？
You could focus you could decide that I don't want most things. I think we have a lot of unnecessary desires that we just pick up everywhere. We have opinions on everything, judgements and everything. 你可以选择专注，决定自己不需要大多数东西。我认为我们有很多不必要的欲望，只是随处沾染而来。我们对每件事都有看法、评判和执念。
So I think just knowing that those are the source of unhappiness，uh, will make you be choosy about your desires. And Frankly, if you want to be successful, you have to be choose about your desirs. You have to focus. 所以我认为，只要意识到这些正是痛苦的根源，呃，就会让你对欲望有所取舍。坦白说，若想成功，就必须对欲望精挑细选。你必须保持专注。
you can't be graded. 你无法在所有事上都出类拔萃。
Everything you can be great. Everything you to waste energy and . 若想事事精通，只会浪费精力徒劳无功。
waste time is famous, worthwhile. Go. 浪费时间也能出名，值得一试。来吧。
uh, IT gets you invite you to Better parties, gets you to Better restaurants. A fame. So fame is this funny thing where a lot of people know you but you don't know them. 呃，IT（信息技术）能让你受邀参加更高级的派对，带你去更高级的餐厅。这就是名气。名气这玩意儿挺有意思——很多人认识你，你却对他们一无所知。
And a IT does get you put in pedestal IT can get you what you want at a at a distance. So I wouldn't say it's worthless. Obviously people wanted for a reason um it's high status. So IT attracts the opposite sex, especially for many attracts a women uh that said, IT is high cost IT means you have no privacy um you do have weird and little tics. Uh you do get hit up a lot for weird things and you're on a stage so you're forced to perform so you're force to be consistent with your past proclamations and actions. And you gonna have haters and all that concise, but the fact that we do IT, the fact that we all seem to want IT, means that IT would be discontinuous to say, I don't know, i'm famous, but you don't want to be famous that said, I think fame like anything else, is best produced as a or pursued as a by product of something potentially more worthwhile um wanting to be famous and craving to be famous and being famous for being famous. IT 确实能把你捧上神坛，让你隔空获得想要的东西。所以不能说它毫无价值。显然人们追求它是有原因的，嗯...这是高社会地位的象征。它能吸引异性，尤其对多数男性而言能吸引女性。不过话说回来，IT 的代价很高——意味着你毫无隐私，还会养成些古怪的小习惯。你会频繁遭遇各种奇葩请求，就像活在舞台上被迫表演，必须保持与过往言行的一致性。还会有黑粉什么的...但重点是我们都在追逐 IT，似乎人人都想要 IT，这就很矛盾——比如有人说"我出名了但不想出名"。我认为名气和其他东西一样，最好是作为更有价值事物的副产品来创造或追求...单纯为出名而渴望出名，或仅以出名而闻名。
These are sort of traps fame for . 这些某种程度上都是名气的陷阱。
some sake yeah exactly. So it's Better than its own thing. Uh, so for example, own respect in the as you do things that are good for the tribe, uh, who are the most famous people in human history? 确实如此。所以这比单纯追求个人成就更有意义。比如说，当你做一些对群体有益的事情时，就会赢得尊重——人类历史上最著名的人物都是谁呢？
Uh, there are you know there there are people who sort of transcended themself, the budders and the jesus in the mohamad of the world. Who else is famous? Uh, the artists are famous. 那些超越自我的人会被铭记，比如佛陀、耶稣和穆罕默德这样的世界级人物。还有哪些名人？艺术家也很出名。
You know, art last for a long time. The scientists are famous. They discover thing. The congress are famous, present because they conquered for their tribe. There was someone that they were fighting for. 要知道，艺术作品能流传千古。科学家因发现真理而闻名。征服者为部落征战四方而青史留名，他们背后都有为之奋斗的群体。
So generally the higher up by doing things for greater and greater groups of people, even though IT may be considered tyrannical or negative, like you know, JK as famous, but uh, to the mongols, he was doing good to the rest of them, not so much. A the higher level you're Operating at, the more people you're taking care of, the more you sort of earned respect and fame. And I think those are good reasons to be famous. 通常来说，你惠及的群体规模越大——即便可能被外界视为暴君或负面人物，比如成吉思汗对蒙古人是英雄，对其他民族则不然——所处的层次越高，关照的人群越广，就越能赢得尊重与声望。我认为这些才是成名的正当理由。
If fame is empty, if your fame is just because your name showed up in a lot of places or your face showed up in a lot of places, then that's a holo fame. And I think deep down you will know that. And so be fragile and you'll be afraid of losing IT, and then you'll be force to perform. 若虚名仅是因姓名频繁出现或面孔随处可见而得，那不过是虚幻的声名。我想你心底自会明了。因此你会变得脆弱，唯恐失去它，继而被迫表演。
So the kind of fame that uh, pure actors and celebrities have, I wouldn't want, but the kind of fame that's earn because you did something useful. A why dodge that? No, you can. 纯粹的演员与名流所拥有的那种声名，我绝不向往；但若因做出有益之事而赢得的声誉，何必回避？不，你大可坦然接受。
This is a chAllenge, I think, especially if people make very loud public proclamations about things mentioned there about um you're almost a hostage to the things that used to say that um being able to update your opinions and change your mind you looks very similar to the internet as hypocrisy does you know the difference between me saying something in the past and saying something different now is perhaps i've learned, perhaps i've updated my believing, right? But so few people do IT in a legitimate way. 这确实是个挑战，尤其当人们针对某些事高调发表公开声明时——你会沦为过往言论的人质。在互联网眼中，更新观点与改变立场看起来与虚伪无异。要知道，我今日所言与昔日不同，或许只因我已有所领悟、更新了信念，对吗？但能以正当方式做到这点的人实在寥寥。
I think that the grifter shell you see, this is the smoking gun that shows that he didn't really believe that thing all along. And yeah, II went to a retreat in LA. A couple of years ago and there was a guy that used to follow the but big business and productivity advice content creator really, really successful. And you just told this step back from everything like monk mode and focused on his business and asking wine, he said, I started feeling like I had to live up to in private the things that I was saying in public. right? 我认为你看到的这个骗子外壳，就是证明他从未真正相信那件事的铁证。几年前我参加过洛杉矶的一个静修会，有个曾经追随商业大佬的内容创作者——专门做生产力建议类内容，做得非常成功。他后来退出一切进入"僧侣模式"专注事业，喝着红酒说："我开始觉得私下必须活成公开宣称的样子"，明白吗？
Yeah, it's a what was that? Who said he was a mankind? That foolish consistency of how goblin of little minds, right? But essentially, look, all this is all learning is error correction, right? Every knowledge creation system works through correcting errors, making guesses and correcting error. So by definition, if you're learning, you can be wrong most the time, and you will be updating your payers. 是啊，那句话怎么说来着？谁说人类就该保持愚蠢的一致性？就像小妖精般狭隘的思维对吧？但本质上，所有学习都是纠错过程。每个知识创造系统都通过纠正错误、提出猜想再修正来运作。所以从定义上说，只要你还在学习，就注定会经常犯错，并不断更新你的认知筹码。
And so for example, later this jeroen, an podcasting I was eight or nine years ago and people will call out like the one thing that didn't turn out to be correct and it's just like they're just beat on IT because IT IT helps them, in their mind, raise their status a little bit. Aha, I caught him in an error. Well, I think if you catch someone in the britain lie where there's believe one thing and they say another, that's legit. 举个例子，后来我在杰伦的播客里提到，八九年前人们会揪住某个不准确的预测不放——他们之所以死磕这点，是因为在心理上，这能稍微抬高自己的身价。"哈！我可算逮到他的错了。"要是指出对方心口不一，比如心里相信某件事却嘴上否认，这种批评还算站得住脚。
That's a character flaw. Dishonors be lying. But on the other hand, if they just made a guest at something and they got a wrong, and by the way, most leads about the AIAGI think and I think i'm still right about with a different story um people who think we have achieved agi just failed toru tests from their side. 那属于品格缺陷。说谎是 dishonorable 的行为。但另一方面，如果对方只是做出推测却判断失误（顺便说，现在大多数关于 AGI 的论断都是如此，虽然我依然坚持自己的观点），那些认为我们已经实现 AGI 的人，其实连自己这关的图灵测试都没通过。
It's funny how people latch on to single proclaim tions, but the reality is all of us are dynamic systems. We're always changing. We're always learning. 有趣的是人们总爱揪着个别论断不放，但事实上所有人都是动态系统。我们永远在变化，永远在学习。
We're always grow. And uh, hopefully we're correcting errors. But you don't want to be doing is lying in public so that because you're you're trying to look good. 永远在成长。呃...但愿我们都在修正错误。但切忌为了维护形象而当众撒谎——毕竟你只是在假装完美。